As far as the football ref is concerned, I leave it in the skilful hands of the world's most successful living author to comment...
"Crossdressing straight men are currently one of the most pandered-to demographics in existence, and women are under no obligation to applaud the people caricaturing us’. We must all have the right to call a man a man."
I was thinking about this stuff the other day, and it occurred to me that it’s a bit like the minstrel shows were in the US in the early 20th century. People putting on an “identity” to parody it, while loudly proclaiming that it was actually an “homage”. Maybe one day in the future, this will be seen similarly?
I'd say that the parallel you draw has been acknowledged by many. I entirely agree with it as an example. Womanface...donning traditional and stereotypical 'feminine' garb, either to parody women, or to emulate them is as deeply offensive to me, as wearing Blackface. The latter has been universally condemned, whilst the former is lauded (in some quarters, by people who should have more sense) as stunning and brave. It is neither of those things.
Yeah, I think there's a lot more wrong with KJK than calling men men. She's a homophobe, narcissistic, right wing woman with a penchant for anti abortion groups and their handouts.
People just make shit up. It’s unreal. It seems some women in here just want to lie and smear and attack their own supposed side for not being exactly like themselves, or for being uppity, or god knows what. And so the gender critical/sex realist side is ripping itself apart. Fucking classic.
"Pearl-clutching?" Is that those timerous, fearful women most likely suffering from PTSD resulting from childhood abuse, domestic violence or sexual harassment? I hate the phrase. So patronizing, condescending and part and parcel of the bleeder, breeder, b*tch litany. Please think about it and don't give women another crushing, degrading label.
I've really been inspired to buy some pearls. I saw a nice strand of freshwater ones in a cataloge today. I think it will be very soothing to clutch them when I have writer's block, which I do chronically.
I have a beautiful [real or not] strand of pearls I would never clutch, because it would break at some point, pearls scattering all over, and that would be a bad thing. Not recommended. Clutch a blouse or a dishcloth or some other housewifey thing, but be sure you don’t simper while clutching. Though I have been heard simpering–well I think that’s what Ms. Watson would call it, that being her favorite word–when things felt, at the time, to be too much. Luckily the difficult moment passed. Likewise may your writer’s block pass.
I don’t need to think about it. Women have a choice about whether to be a victim. I choose not to be and I can’t be bothered with simpering, weak, pathetic housewives.
Shit happens. It’s up to you how you deal with it. Feminism used to be about giving women the tools, not reinforcing pathetic victimhood.
Yes, Dr. MARIE , You're right. Housewife doesn't equal weak. Elizabeth Cady Stanton was a "house wife" with 7 kids and also a brilliant political strategist, tireless sufferagist and free thinker as have been many other women like Lois Gibbs of Love Canal. We have all been housewives - sometimes paid and other times unpaid for our own children and elderly parents. As for those struck down by male predators I will never fault them for their reaction to rape, torture, battering or emotional abuse. But I do lose respect for those women who cater to male approval, those who opportunistically promote their own financial interests and those who value the celebrated supposed masculinist attributes like callousness, aggression, insensitivity and selfishness, often mistaken for courage and decisiveness.
It certainly doesn’t equal feminist. Women fought in the second half of the twentieth century, and I was one of them, for women to have equal legal and financial rights, and every single housewife undermines that.
And, no, it isn’t a choice. Men don’t have a choice. With equality comes responsibility.
‘Housewives’ are a pathetic, middle class concept. Working class women have always worked. Feminism ensured that they were paid properly for it.
Most women ‘grow up socialised to be weak’. Feminism used to be about raising the consciousness of that and encouraging them to reject it and be strong. Reinforcing fearful weakness and simpering dependence on men does women no favours at all and it is certainly not feminism.
Reading down thread, I believe "Caroline Watson" to be Doyle's newest reboot of Titania McGrath.
Unfortunately, this caricature is more "horror" genre than comedy. "Caroline's" frothing outrage and obvious psychological projections are exactly as pathetic as "she" insists married women and mothers to be. What an abject character. Titania has far more wit.
It’s you pathetic, weak, simpering, frightened housewives who are the handmaidens. Believing everything that the 'gender’ ideologues tell you about how weak and pathetic you are.
There were women fighting for our rights who were far braver than you when they didn’t even have the vote!
Pathetic women like you have given up on equality. You’ve given up on being autonomous adults. You are a disgrace to your sex and the women who went before.
Go and crawl under your pathetic little rock and drown.
I’m not surprised by your response - I read some of your other replies and it’s clear you are a morbidly intractable psycho with a DEEP well of hatred against any woman you deem beneath you. Enjoy your futile rage - it’s clearly eating you from the inside out, but hey, whatever floats your crazy boat 🤪
If you’re not surprised, why comment? Except, of course, because the person who actually feels superior, as so many legal prostitutes (aka ‘wives’) so often do, is you.
You continue with that delusion, pet, because who knows what will happen when you finally admit to yourself that you are basically a whore but, unlike professional whores, you have to do the disgusting creature’s washing as well 🤣
You are a truly vile person, but I’m sure you’re already aware of that fact. In a way, I actually feel sorry for you - it’s got to be miserable to be inside your head, consumed with impotent rage, fiending and fuming that you can’t control other people’s lives or the way they think. Driving you a bit mad, isn’t it?
Now that his mask is off its pretty clear he never deserved the kid-gloves treatment he received from you or anyone else. I hope this leads to an increase in support for LWS and the Party of Women. KJK has come at you pretty hard for appeasing Hayton in the past, but she was right about him.
I don't agree that Julie was being judgemental about Hayton's wife, by saying that her heart was breaking for her? I read nothing that suggests that, at any point, criticism was aimed at any other person than Hayton himself, and I'm pretty sure no yelling was involved.
I think Hayton is, at least in some ways, worse than the others. His ability to deceive has enabled him to worm his way into the good books of people who wouldn't usually countenance him. Not only women - I thought him a reasonable voice at first, too - but a lot of high-profile people, into whose good graces he has insinuated himself and now find it difficult to rid themselves of. He's a sneak, a double agent, the lowest of the low. I hope more people realise this before he causes more rifts.
He didn't deceive me! What he did was to be less abhorrent than this fellows and look like a good guy by comparison. No doubt a deliberate strategy by a man who clearly still has some glimmers of self-awareness in there.
AGP is a mental illness, practicing it on others is not a right but abuse.
I stand in great admiration, Fredro. I'm glad some people saw through him early on. I have little doubt it is a deliberate strategy on his part. The fact it worked so well and that he must be sniggering with his cohort makes me quite annoyed.
To whom you are attracted sexually is purely subjective and therefore cannot reasonably be contested by an outside observer. Where you decide to live your life on a spectrum of superficial, stereotypical male to female attributes (and we all do) is also purely subjective and similarly cannot be questioned. However, your biological sex reflects an objective reality which cannot be changed by your subjective personal view and futile attempts to do so can result in serious health impacts to you as well as actual harms to members of the sex you are impersonating (especially women). Finally, others who are grounded in objective reality should never be forced to accept your subjective version of your actual biological sex.
Happy to hear his rotten mask has finally slipped- he's been causing damage behind enemy lines for long enough! JK Rowling is king and Dave Hayton is nothing more than a self-serving pervert. Thanks Julie, I hope JK buries him.
Brava Julie. It's so hard for strong women to admit we got something wrong when we are SO relentlessly told that we are altogether wrong and bad. I too fell for Hayton's schtick, feeling his admission about his AGP was the potential gamechanger needed to wake people up to the vulnerable minority narrative sold by the TQ tyrants. And Posie, who saw Payton for what he is, much earlier on was against the 'radical feminist' objection to men identifying as women. I don't know if she has admitted that mistake yet, but as one of her supporters at the Auckland LWS event when her life was in real danger from these psychotic tyrants, I know that what she does is brave and important frontline activism and feminism, whatever she prefers to call it, and that she is not remotely the 'simpering housewife' she is being accused of here by at least one commentator.
She deliberately provokes violent men and then squeals for other men, and lesbians, to save her. Then she obsesses breathlessly about ‘my husband and children’.
Ooh, women 'provoking' men to violence. I think you'll find that is 101 of the violent misogynist's playbook. Stunned to see it repeated here against Posie. Some feminists, or women's rights activists, live with men and have children. I am one such feminist, Posie is another. I presume you are not in this demographic. Good for you. But without us, the feminist cause is fucked. So maybe you need to 'give it a break.' And in case I too am dismissed as a 'breathless', 'simpering housewife', I will just point out that my PhD thesis was on battered women who kill their abusers and how the justice system fails them.
There is nothing wrong with a woman choosing to be a stay at home mother, or not being a mother at all. CHOICE. Most working mothers have jobs not careers to help support their families. Feminists come from all walks of life and calling any of them simpering pearl clutching is offensive. Daycare centers for working families are staffed overwhelmingly with women for Pete’s sake. One of my daughters is fortunate to be able to stay at home after 15 years as a critical care nurse, as her husband travels for work. That enables her to take care of her kids and to be actively involved in Moms Demand Action for sensible gun laws and to volunteer in numerous women’s campaigns for office. She doesn’t own pearls and she doesn’t simmper.
WOW! You presume SO much. I won a $45K doctoral scholarship (in 1999, when that was a lot of money) and tutored for the majority of years I was working on my thesis. I was also raising my three young kids all the while, the only tutor, mostly male, to be doing that kind of WORK. But I'm sure you were using your time in a much less simpering, more productive fashion.
No. Your assumption that I am shows that you are just as captured by ‘gender’ stereotypes as apologists for the eponymous ideology.
It is ironic that so many women who oppose men in women’s lavatories (but, curiously, rarely the mutilation of young lesbians, whereas I consider that to be more important) do so by adopting the same breathless, girly, simpering as those they profess to abhor.
You can give it out, can’t you, with your passive aggressive, housewife whining, but challenging you is ‘hate’.
Yes, I do hate spongers. Most people in Britain do. We’re a social democracy, predicated on all physically able adults working to pay for the things we value, like the NHS. When people of either sex opt out of that, for their own selfish reasons, the system breaks down.
Hayton never fooled me. A man who teaches physics knows enough about science to know that humans don't change sex.
And him working in a school is a major safeguarding red flag. I have equal disgust for the school administration who are pushing students to pretend he is a woman. They are both abusing their power.
Grateful to you Julie, for all you are and all you do, with such courage, intelligence, heart, and honesty, all of which are magnificently on display in this piece.
I am lately developing an unpleasant feeling that comments from men like this about trans are not just trolling, but actually part of the fetish. The game is getting sexually fulfillment from sadistic trolling of women - only women.
To me, Hayton always seemed to model something called machiavellian narcissism.
What many read as humility was actually a manipulation that flattered progressive thinking left leaning liberals to believe they had superior morality by feeling comfortable in finding a fetish performance accceptable. If a survey of the education levels of the Hayton apologists were ever done, I'll wager the peeps who thought he was no problem at all had academic schooling.
Our original instincts usually turn out to be exactly right, don’t they!
As far as the football ref is concerned, I leave it in the skilful hands of the world's most successful living author to comment...
"Crossdressing straight men are currently one of the most pandered-to demographics in existence, and women are under no obligation to applaud the people caricaturing us’. We must all have the right to call a man a man."
I was thinking about this stuff the other day, and it occurred to me that it’s a bit like the minstrel shows were in the US in the early 20th century. People putting on an “identity” to parody it, while loudly proclaiming that it was actually an “homage”. Maybe one day in the future, this will be seen similarly?
I'd say that the parallel you draw has been acknowledged by many. I entirely agree with it as an example. Womanface...donning traditional and stereotypical 'feminine' garb, either to parody women, or to emulate them is as deeply offensive to me, as wearing Blackface. The latter has been universally condemned, whilst the former is lauded (in some quarters, by people who should have more sense) as stunning and brave. It is neither of those things.
Fascinating! Now perhaps is a good time to apologise to Kellie-Jay Keen and join forces with her?
Yeah, I think there's a lot more wrong with KJK than calling men men. She's a homophobe, narcissistic, right wing woman with a penchant for anti abortion groups and their handouts.
No thanks.
She’s not homophobic or right wing and she has said that she is pro choice.
People just make shit up. It’s unreal. It seems some women in here just want to lie and smear and attack their own supposed side for not being exactly like themselves, or for being uppity, or god knows what. And so the gender critical/sex realist side is ripping itself apart. Fucking classic.
You present little evidence for what you write. Do you expect people to respect you if you talk this way?
Ian Mordant
Hear hear!
Oh no I heard she’s a Nazi far right fascist who probably kicked puppies and did some racisms a few times too.
Do you think anybody gives af when you say things like this? Nobody takes these words seriously anymore because they mean nothing.
Learn how to argue or be quiet.
Dear me. I mean you have to have a weak grasp on integrity to believe in trans fantasy but that's all rather silly.
Goodness, could your comment be more inaccurate? Perhaps engage in some basic research before posting next time.
I thought the exact same thing!
Feminism is not about simpering, pearl clutching housewives who implore men to ‘Let women speak’.
We don’t need their permission or yours.
"Pearl-clutching?" Is that those timerous, fearful women most likely suffering from PTSD resulting from childhood abuse, domestic violence or sexual harassment? I hate the phrase. So patronizing, condescending and part and parcel of the bleeder, breeder, b*tch litany. Please think about it and don't give women another crushing, degrading label.
I've really been inspired to buy some pearls. I saw a nice strand of freshwater ones in a cataloge today. I think it will be very soothing to clutch them when I have writer's block, which I do chronically.
I have a beautiful [real or not] strand of pearls I would never clutch, because it would break at some point, pearls scattering all over, and that would be a bad thing. Not recommended. Clutch a blouse or a dishcloth or some other housewifey thing, but be sure you don’t simper while clutching. Though I have been heard simpering–well I think that’s what Ms. Watson would call it, that being her favorite word–when things felt, at the time, to be too much. Luckily the difficult moment passed. Likewise may your writer’s block pass.
Thank you my dear. I didn't intend to clutch my pearls very hard - just pensively while mulling my next move.
Edited to add: if by clutch you meant gentle holding or touching them, yes they’re very soothing. No offense intended.
I don’t need to think about it. Women have a choice about whether to be a victim. I choose not to be and I can’t be bothered with simpering, weak, pathetic housewives.
Shit happens. It’s up to you how you deal with it. Feminism used to be about giving women the tools, not reinforcing pathetic victimhood.
‘Housewife’ doesn’t equal weak.
Yes, Dr. MARIE , You're right. Housewife doesn't equal weak. Elizabeth Cady Stanton was a "house wife" with 7 kids and also a brilliant political strategist, tireless sufferagist and free thinker as have been many other women like Lois Gibbs of Love Canal. We have all been housewives - sometimes paid and other times unpaid for our own children and elderly parents. As for those struck down by male predators I will never fault them for their reaction to rape, torture, battering or emotional abuse. But I do lose respect for those women who cater to male approval, those who opportunistically promote their own financial interests and those who value the celebrated supposed masculinist attributes like callousness, aggression, insensitivity and selfishness, often mistaken for courage and decisiveness.
I have never been a ‘housewife’ and will never be. I don’t do ‘caring’. That’s why I went to university - to escape domestic shit.
The fact that you compare yourself to an early twentieth century feminist shows that American women haven’t moved on one iota. How pathetic.
It certainly doesn’t equal feminist. Women fought in the second half of the twentieth century, and I was one of them, for women to have equal legal and financial rights, and every single housewife undermines that.
And, no, it isn’t a choice. Men don’t have a choice. With equality comes responsibility.
‘Housewives’ are a pathetic, middle class concept. Working class women have always worked. Feminism ensured that they were paid properly for it.
Caroline Watson, please show some empathy for women who can’t ‘choose’ like you so proudly declare.
Unfortunately, some people mistake kindness for weakness.
Why can’t they choose? They don’t have to breed. Feminists made sure of that.
Sounds like you've been reading too many Marvel comics.
Most women ‘grow up socialised to be weak’. Feminism used to be about raising the consciousness of that and encouraging them to reject it and be strong. Reinforcing fearful weakness and simpering dependence on men does women no favours at all and it is certainly not feminism.
Caroline, belittling frightened women won’t work either.
Reading down thread, I believe "Caroline Watson" to be Doyle's newest reboot of Titania McGrath.
Unfortunately, this caricature is more "horror" genre than comedy. "Caroline's" frothing outrage and obvious psychological projections are exactly as pathetic as "she" insists married women and mothers to be. What an abject character. Titania has far more wit.
That’s got to be one of stupidest comments on here. Well-done, oh good and faithful handmaiden. 👏
It’s you pathetic, weak, simpering, frightened housewives who are the handmaidens. Believing everything that the 'gender’ ideologues tell you about how weak and pathetic you are.
There were women fighting for our rights who were far braver than you when they didn’t even have the vote!
Pathetic women like you have given up on equality. You’ve given up on being autonomous adults. You are a disgrace to your sex and the women who went before.
Go and crawl under your pathetic little rock and drown.
I’m not surprised by your response - I read some of your other replies and it’s clear you are a morbidly intractable psycho with a DEEP well of hatred against any woman you deem beneath you. Enjoy your futile rage - it’s clearly eating you from the inside out, but hey, whatever floats your crazy boat 🤪
If you’re not surprised, why comment? Except, of course, because the person who actually feels superior, as so many legal prostitutes (aka ‘wives’) so often do, is you.
You continue with that delusion, pet, because who knows what will happen when you finally admit to yourself that you are basically a whore but, unlike professional whores, you have to do the disgusting creature’s washing as well 🤣
You are a truly vile person, but I’m sure you’re already aware of that fact. In a way, I actually feel sorry for you - it’s got to be miserable to be inside your head, consumed with impotent rage, fiending and fuming that you can’t control other people’s lives or the way they think. Driving you a bit mad, isn’t it?
Absolutely.
Charming. I suggest you wash your foul mouth out.
I got a good laugh out of this comment 🤣
Now that his mask is off its pretty clear he never deserved the kid-gloves treatment he received from you or anyone else. I hope this leads to an increase in support for LWS and the Party of Women. KJK has come at you pretty hard for appeasing Hayton in the past, but she was right about him.
KJK is the leading lady. She held the line while the happy crumb hunters cleared a path for Hayton to get his woman hating message onto big platforms.
I wonder if being seen and accepted as one of the good trans, by feminists, is part of Hayton's AGP?
I don't see why not. It's affirmation isn't it?
I don't agree that Julie was being judgemental about Hayton's wife, by saying that her heart was breaking for her? I read nothing that suggests that, at any point, criticism was aimed at any other person than Hayton himself, and I'm pretty sure no yelling was involved.
I think Hayton is, at least in some ways, worse than the others. His ability to deceive has enabled him to worm his way into the good books of people who wouldn't usually countenance him. Not only women - I thought him a reasonable voice at first, too - but a lot of high-profile people, into whose good graces he has insinuated himself and now find it difficult to rid themselves of. He's a sneak, a double agent, the lowest of the low. I hope more people realise this before he causes more rifts.
He didn't deceive me! What he did was to be less abhorrent than this fellows and look like a good guy by comparison. No doubt a deliberate strategy by a man who clearly still has some glimmers of self-awareness in there.
AGP is a mental illness, practicing it on others is not a right but abuse.
I stand in great admiration, Fredro. I'm glad some people saw through him early on. I have little doubt it is a deliberate strategy on his part. The fact it worked so well and that he must be sniggering with his cohort makes me quite annoyed.
So glad to hear this! Fuck the crumbs! X
To whom you are attracted sexually is purely subjective and therefore cannot reasonably be contested by an outside observer. Where you decide to live your life on a spectrum of superficial, stereotypical male to female attributes (and we all do) is also purely subjective and similarly cannot be questioned. However, your biological sex reflects an objective reality which cannot be changed by your subjective personal view and futile attempts to do so can result in serious health impacts to you as well as actual harms to members of the sex you are impersonating (especially women). Finally, others who are grounded in objective reality should never be forced to accept your subjective version of your actual biological sex.
Happy to hear his rotten mask has finally slipped- he's been causing damage behind enemy lines for long enough! JK Rowling is king and Dave Hayton is nothing more than a self-serving pervert. Thanks Julie, I hope JK buries him.
JKR is ‘Queen,’ and I don’t usually support royalty. ;-)
Brava Julie. It's so hard for strong women to admit we got something wrong when we are SO relentlessly told that we are altogether wrong and bad. I too fell for Hayton's schtick, feeling his admission about his AGP was the potential gamechanger needed to wake people up to the vulnerable minority narrative sold by the TQ tyrants. And Posie, who saw Payton for what he is, much earlier on was against the 'radical feminist' objection to men identifying as women. I don't know if she has admitted that mistake yet, but as one of her supporters at the Auckland LWS event when her life was in real danger from these psychotic tyrants, I know that what she does is brave and important frontline activism and feminism, whatever she prefers to call it, and that she is not remotely the 'simpering housewife' she is being accused of here by at least one commentator.
She deliberately provokes violent men and then squeals for other men, and lesbians, to save her. Then she obsesses breathlessly about ‘my husband and children’.
Give it a break.
Ooh, women 'provoking' men to violence. I think you'll find that is 101 of the violent misogynist's playbook. Stunned to see it repeated here against Posie. Some feminists, or women's rights activists, live with men and have children. I am one such feminist, Posie is another. I presume you are not in this demographic. Good for you. But without us, the feminist cause is fucked. So maybe you need to 'give it a break.' And in case I too am dismissed as a 'breathless', 'simpering housewife', I will just point out that my PhD thesis was on battered women who kill their abusers and how the justice system fails them.
There is nothing wrong with a woman choosing to be a stay at home mother, or not being a mother at all. CHOICE. Most working mothers have jobs not careers to help support their families. Feminists come from all walks of life and calling any of them simpering pearl clutching is offensive. Daycare centers for working families are staffed overwhelmingly with women for Pete’s sake. One of my daughters is fortunate to be able to stay at home after 15 years as a critical care nurse, as her husband travels for work. That enables her to take care of her kids and to be actively involved in Moms Demand Action for sensible gun laws and to volunteer in numerous women’s campaigns for office. She doesn’t own pearls and she doesn’t simmper.
Bully for you. Talk the talk but don’t have the guts to walk the walk.
Who paid for your PhD and kept you while you did it? I think we can guess the answer to that question, and some of us can see the irony if you can’t.
WOW! You presume SO much. I won a $45K doctoral scholarship (in 1999, when that was a lot of money) and tutored for the majority of years I was working on my thesis. I was also raising my three young kids all the while, the only tutor, mostly male, to be doing that kind of WORK. But I'm sure you were using your time in a much less simpering, more productive fashion.
Dollars. That explains everything. America, where The Stepford Wives wasn’t a dystopian 1970s film but an aspiration.
Caroline, you are a man. It's obvious.
No. Your assumption that I am shows that you are just as captured by ‘gender’ stereotypes as apologists for the eponymous ideology.
It is ironic that so many women who oppose men in women’s lavatories (but, curiously, rarely the mutilation of young lesbians, whereas I consider that to be more important) do so by adopting the same breathless, girly, simpering as those they profess to abhor.
Elizabeth does not deserve such a hate filled response. No one does. Give it a break Caroline.
Yes she does. So do you.
You can give it out, can’t you, with your passive aggressive, housewife whining, but challenging you is ‘hate’.
Yes, I do hate spongers. Most people in Britain do. We’re a social democracy, predicated on all physically able adults working to pay for the things we value, like the NHS. When people of either sex opt out of that, for their own selfish reasons, the system breaks down.
Clearly not something Americans understand.
Caroline a question please. Do you admire Margaret Thatcher? Ian Mordant
Deliberately provokes violent men?
Yes.
Hayton never fooled me. A man who teaches physics knows enough about science to know that humans don't change sex.
And him working in a school is a major safeguarding red flag. I have equal disgust for the school administration who are pushing students to pretend he is a woman. They are both abusing their power.
Grateful to you Julie, for all you are and all you do, with such courage, intelligence, heart, and honesty, all of which are magnificently on display in this piece.
I am lately developing an unpleasant feeling that comments from men like this about trans are not just trolling, but actually part of the fetish. The game is getting sexually fulfillment from sadistic trolling of women - only women.
He's a man driven by his fetish; he told you and KJK told you.
To me, Hayton always seemed to model something called machiavellian narcissism.
What many read as humility was actually a manipulation that flattered progressive thinking left leaning liberals to believe they had superior morality by feeling comfortable in finding a fetish performance accceptable. If a survey of the education levels of the Hayton apologists were ever done, I'll wager the peeps who thought he was no problem at all had academic schooling.