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Elizabeth Hummel's avatar

Thank you so much to you and Meghan both for creating this. What a necessary gift in this moment. I am an American feminist, have read your books and been very persuaded by your arguments. I also have been very persuaded by Meghan's arguments and others on the side of working with "the right." Your first piece tugs at me considerably. I really look forward to all your thoughts in this exchange. But like many American and Canadian feminists, I still veer more to Meghan's point of view. I am planning on attending one of the Speaker’s Corner events with Kellie-Jay in a few weeks.

I was on a panel that opposed a bill last spring in my state of Washington that destroys the public's ability to know if males are in the women's prison. The panel was organized by the Women’s Liberation Front (WoLF), who as you know partner with conservatives. It was my first time putting my face and name in the public record in opposition to the grotesque anti-woman policies of self-ID laws and policies. As a life-long Democrat who had worked for Democrats in my state legislature and knew the Senators I was addressing on a first name basis, it was terrifying. I almost did not do it because of the possible repercussions to my entire life. Still reeling from the mass exodus of my former friends and band mates, others in the arts and in politics-- my entire network really. But I did it and am glad I did it--and I was one of only three (besides WoLF staff) who were from the left. One of the evangelical Christian women who testified has become a very good friend.

Without WoLF opening its doors to all women, there would have been only a few of us of us standing up against this madness. Yes, we lost in my very blue state, but that was to be expected. The record counts, as you know. WoLF was the only place I could find to join that was organizing on behalf of incarcerated women in the US. They are the only ones who had a lawsuit. They were the only place the conservative women could make their voices heard, too. They are the reason I learned about one of the plaintiffs, Tomiekia, who inspired a song I recorded. Their website informed me of the abuses happening and helped me understand the law in California that has opened the door to such horrific abuses.

Tomiekia has now become a friend who writes me about further abuses. She herself is not a feminist and is a Christian. She’s a Black woman a generation younger than me, I’m a white woman who has never been near a prison but who wants to understand her life on her terms. She killed her husband after years of physical abuse, that’s why she’s in prison. We write to each other and try to find common ground.

Another flaccid opponent of the bill in WA was the organization representing the press. You’d think they would have fought the lack of public disclosure access tooth and nail, but they did not. They came up with a meaningless “compromise” that only compromised women and allowed the self-ID policy to stand. Bottom line, because of this bill we cannot find out how many men are in the women’s prison. The bill was crafted precisely to keep this information from the public. If those men “identify” as women, they are counted as women. And the local press ALSO did not report on it! I spent hours talking to the lobbyist for the press, who I knew well in the Days Before, but even though he said he “got it,” he wouldn’t really fight it.

The only report was by a very conservative national US paper, the Washington Times. A paper I had never heard of because most of my life I have trusted the New York Times and the Washington Post and National Public Radio. As you know Julie, having been reported on many times, the press almost never gets things right when you actually know the inside story. But Valerie Richardson did real journalism. It was not a right-wing flame-up-the base piece, it was completely accurate. That is the only significant press this horrible bill got, putting the women in our state into even greater danger. I was grateful. I thanked her sincerely, and I am still in touch with her about what I know of what is going on in Washington prisons.

So it’s a complex terrain across the pond. My new friend that I met who testified against this bill with me calls herself a Christian feminist. She is in the trenches supporting the women in our prisons too, doing the work of trying to get their stories out there. When we had the “abortion conversation,” it turned out we are not even very far off on that from each other. She used to be a committed pro-lifer, but has mitigated her stance to include exceptions for rape and incest. She is even open to first term abortions at this point. Over the decades, it can be (and has been) argued that the unwillingness of feminists and others on the left to compromise an inch about abortion to instate policies most Americans support has put us in this terrible place where the right to have an abortion in any circumstance is being destroyed in state after state—and may be destroyed entirely if the Republicans control Congress and the White House, as is a real possibility.

I know there is the strategic argument for working with conservatives, that’s obvious. But I have found that my horizons have expanded by knowing and working with conservatives who are good people. And I think their horizons have expanded by knowing me, by considering feminist perspectives, by being reminded that feminists have done so much for all women. My in-laws are Mormons, and my sisters-in law are very conventional in most ways—but they would never go back to the 1950s. They like their daughters having options. It’s a bitter irony that it is feminists like you and so many others who have made that possible and succeeded in making the culture better for women. You will never get the credit you deserve. But maybe you’ll get more credit than otherwise as people coming from different places talk to one another, work on common goals, and try to see the world from different viewpoints.

The strongest part of your argument for me is that if we don’t see that patriarchy as the root of the issue, we are not really solving the problem of women’s oppression, we are not really moving towards women’s liberation. Julie, I was honored that you quote-tweeted an article I wrote on Colin Wright’s Substack about the prison issue a few weeks back. Colin, who is a good editor, toned down some of the original feminist perspective in my piece. The final was more of a “progressive to progressive” argument and a bit less of a feminist argument. I allowed the edits and decided that was a good choice, as it might reach more people. The result? JK Rowling quote tweeted my article within minutes of it being posted, which is why you saw it. Alison Bailey, Maya Forstater and John Cleese all quote tweeted it too. What went out to tens of thousands of people was a compromise.

Here is just one para that was omitted:

Why does this fight for women’s safety, dignity, and empowerment create such backlash, such bewilderingly blinkered thinking, even from progressives who used to proudly fight for women’s rights? I believe the answer comes back to the remarkable persistence of patriarchy over many centuries. Women (with our male friends at our sides) beat it back again and again, age after age. But patriarchy has a way of reconstituting itself, arising like a zombie from the dead to plague us in new ways. Patriarchy is like a poisonous smoke which finds its way into the cracks of any culture, destroying empathy and reason. Our entire culture is threatened by the seismic crack of gender ideology, which at its heart denies the reality of biological sex. Patriarchy seeps through and is bad for everyone. But as throughout the ages, those most harmed are women and children.

I also submitted the article or a pitch to every feminist site I knew of before submitting to Colin. In the end, I felt like it was “feminist enough,” and I knew Colin had a pretty big reach well beyond my little Substack. Given the urgency of this issue, I think the compromise in the tone and message was justified. Women are being hurt every single day and I want people to care about it, from whatever vantage point they can. And Colin is not a “right-wing” guy, he’s an evolutionary biologist who has been center-left most of his life. My point is that we always make some compromises to work with others. The issue is where we draw the lines. And it is not an easy decision, ever.

I really appreciate you making this post and further letters to Meghan available to all of us. It’s such an important conversation.

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Stroppysaurus's avatar

As you have pointed out, men on both sides of the political spectrum are not really supportive of women's rights. So really, we need a plan that addresses issues on both sides. I've not come across any GC feminists saying anything about Tommy Robinson let alone praise him but I will take your word for it. It is not only men who disappoint. In my view this fight can only be won by getting sufficient numbers on board to help educate the vast majority of uninformed people about the true nature of transgenderism and the full impact and insanity of their demands. We need it to snowball. On that basis I would not start getting too choosy as to who I will and won't work with. As for Free Speech, absolutely we need to define boundaries beyond which it is not free. But these boundaries have to be democratically decided not surreptitiously brought in through the back door, as Stonewall has been doing so successfully. They would make it illegal to call a man a man if he claimed he was trans. And that makes my blood boil. The truth has to fall within the boundaries of free speech.

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